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We got 29 AAA schools in WV wrestling.

Using the 120 pound weight class as an example, I am understanding that each 120 pounder from each high school are the 29 BEST in the state because they made varsity on their given team. I have a certain wrestler in mind that I guess is the 30th best using the logic of some.

The 145lbs weight class is another good example.

Bearhugger wrote:We got 29 AAA schools in WV wrestling.

Using the 120 pound weight class as an example, I am understanding that each 120 pounder from each high school are the 29 BEST in the state because they made varsity on their given team. I have a certain wrestler in mind that I guess is the 30th best using the logic of some.

The 145lbs weight class is another good example.

I am pretty certain there are a few high school football teams in WV whose 12th, 13th and 14th best players are on the sidelines while some very poor players on the other team are playing every play. In fairness to them and others like them, the state of WV should modify the game in those instances to allow those teams to require other teams to play 14 players instead of the traditional 11. Please don't point out to me the various differences in the comparison of one to the other. That is not the point. The point is that despite the individual nature of wrestling, you are going to either accept it as a team sport or just go on being unhappy and negative about the set up of the sport for the sake of a half dozen or dozen individuals and continuing this line of conversation at the sake of discussing wrestling.

KDunbar wrote:

Bearhugger wrote:We got 29 AAA schools in WV wrestling.

Using the 120 pound weight class as an example, I am understanding that each 120 pounder from each high school are the 29 BEST in the state because they made varsity on their given team. I have a certain wrestler in mind that I guess is the 30th best using the logic of some.

The 145lbs weight class is another good example.

I am pretty certain there are a few high school football teams in WV whose 12th, 13th and 14th best players are on the sidelines while some very poor players on the other team are playing every play. In fairness to them and others like them, the state of WV should modify the game in those instances to allow those teams to require other teams to play 14 players instead of the traditional 11. Please don't point out to me the various differences in the comparison of one to the other. That is not the point. The point is that despite the individual nature of wrestling, you are going to either accept it as a team sport or just go on being unhappy and negative about the set up of the sport for the sake of a half dozen or dozen individuals and continuing this line of conversation at the sake of discussing wrestling.

Football is a team sport. Wrestling is an individual sport. Please refer to the 2017 state qualifiers that were the LONE wrestler from their school to go.

KDunbar wrote:

Bearhugger wrote:We got 29 AAA schools in WV wrestling.

Using the 120 pound weight class as an example, I am understanding that each 120 pounder from each high school are the 29 BEST in the state because they made varsity on their given team. I have a certain wrestler in mind that I guess is the 30th best using the logic of some.

The 145lbs weight class is another good example.

I am pretty certain there are a few high school football teams in WV whose 12th, 13th and 14th best players are on the sidelines while some very poor players on the other team are playing every play. In fairness to them and others like them, the state of WV should modify the game in those instances to allow those teams to require other teams to play 14 players instead of the traditional 11. Please don't point out to me the various differences in the comparison of one to the other. That is not the point. The point is that despite the individual nature of wrestling, you are going to either accept it as a team sport or just go on being unhappy and negative about the set up of the sport for the sake of a half dozen or dozen individuals and continuing this line of conversation at the sake of discussing wrestling.

Well put. The individual side of the sport can be exercised by wrestling as an independent in open tournaments.

Bearhugger wrote:

KDunbar wrote:

Bearhugger wrote:We got 29 AAA schools in WV wrestling.

Using the 120 pound weight class as an example, I am understanding that each 120 pounder from each high school are the 29 BEST in the state because they made varsity on their given team. I have a certain wrestler in mind that I guess is the 30th best using the logic of some.

The 145lbs weight class is another good example.

I am pretty certain there are a few high school football teams in WV whose 12th, 13th and 14th best players are on the sidelines while some very poor players on the other team are playing every play. In fairness to them and others like them, the state of WV should modify the game in those instances to allow those teams to require other teams to play 14 players instead of the traditional 11. Please don't point out to me the various differences in the comparison of one to the other. That is not the point. The point is that despite the individual nature of wrestling, you are going to either accept it as a team sport or just go on being unhappy and negative about the set up of the sport for the sake of a half dozen or dozen individuals and continuing this line of conversation at the sake of discussing wrestling.

Football is a team sport. Wrestling is an individual sport. Please refer to the 2017 state qualifiers that were the LONE wrestler from their school to go.

This is the key point of difference that prevents anyone from having any influence on your thinking. I believe that a lot of us feel that the high schools throughout the state have wrestling TEAMS and not a group of individuals participating in an individual sport. Some may not have a full TEAM. But nonetheless, they have a wrestling TEAM. If one refuses to accept that concept then they end up making the conclusions that you keep coming to. This makes this a hopeless and fruitless conversation.

KDunbar wrote:

Bearhugger wrote:

KDunbar wrote:
I am pretty certain there are a few high school football teams in WV whose 12th, 13th and 14th best players are on the sidelines while some very poor players on the other team are playing every play. In fairness to them and others like them, the state of WV should modify the game in those instances to allow those teams to require other teams to play 14 players instead of the traditional 11. Please don't point out to me the various differences in the comparison of one to the other. That is not the point. The point is that despite the individual nature of wrestling, you are going to either accept it as a team sport or just go on being unhappy and negative about the set up of the sport for the sake of a half dozen or dozen individuals and continuing this line of conversation at the sake of discussing wrestling.

Football is a team sport. Wrestling is an individual sport. Please refer to the 2017 state qualifiers that were the LONE wrestler from their school to go.

This is the key point of difference that prevents anyone from having any influence on your thinking. I believe that a lot of us feel that the high schools throughout the state have wrestling TEAMS and not a group of individuals participating in an individual sport. Some may not have a full TEAM. But nonetheless, they have a wrestling TEAM. If one refuses to accept that concept then they end up making the conclusions that you keep coming to. This makes this a hopeless and fruitless conversation.

I think what we have is a battle of "traditionalists" versus "realists". All schools have TEAMS, but few stand a chance in team COMPETITION. Individually, many wrestlers can compete and win individual honors. That is the real beauty of the sport. Since the real competition is at the individual level, then I root for the best individuals to be involved. The traditionalists can still have their fun and strive for second place. We need to take a hybrid approach to the situation at hand.

Bearhugger wrote: The traditionalists can still have their fun and strive for second place. We need to take a hybrid approach to the situation at hand.

YOU want the second best wrestler from their own teams to compete in the state and regional tournaments tournament, meaning the BEST they could ever do is second place, meaning that YOU are the one who wants to normalize "striving for second place".
Nice underhanded jab at yourself. Well done.

Is wrestling any different from tennis? Golf? Cross country? etc.?

I'm sure there are a few "JV" golfers, etc. out there that are better than some of the varsity kids on other teams. Does it suck for the jv kid? Maybe, but it's not exclusive to wrestling. And while I agree that tennis players probably don't suffer as much as wrestlers do, that doesn't mean they don't work hard at what they do, and they probably work year round.

greencrush wrote:

Bearhugger wrote: The traditionalists can still have their fun and strive for second place. We need to take a hybrid approach to the situation at hand.

YOU want the second best wrestler from their own teams to compete in the state and regional tournaments tournament, meaning the BEST they could ever do is second place, meaning that YOU are the one who wants to normalize "striving for second place".
Nice underhanded jab at yourself. Well done.

The "second best" wrestler on a given team is also sometimes the second to 6th best in the whole state. The failures of people to be able to sort out these facts and recognize them differentiates us. I would suspect you were one that stayed home from school due to it being cold.

Bearhugger wrote:

KDunbar wrote:

Bearhugger wrote:
Football is a team sport. Wrestling is an individual sport. Please refer to the 2017 state qualifiers that were the LONE wrestler from their school to go.

This is the key point of difference that prevents anyone from having any influence on your thinking. I believe that a lot of us feel that the high schools throughout the state have wrestling TEAMS and not a group of individuals participating in an individual sport. Some may not have a full TEAM. But nonetheless, they have a wrestling TEAM. If one refuses to accept that concept then they end up making the conclusions that you keep coming to. This makes this a hopeless and fruitless conversation.

I think what we have is a battle of "traditionalists" versus "realists". All schools have TEAMS, but few stand a chance in team COMPETITION. Individually, many wrestlers can compete and win individual honors. That is the real beauty of the sport. Since the real competition is at the individual level, then I root for the best individuals to be involved. The traditionalists can still have their fun and strive for second place. We need to take a hybrid approach to the situation at hand.

It strikes me as odd that with a lot of what you write one would peg you as an older individual who realizes the "realities" of the world and society and of "going to school" when it is cold. You say quite a lot in the manner of a realist. However, it seems as if it really got to you when you discovered last year that there was a very good wrestler at East Fairmont who could not wrestle because of the individual ahead of him at his school. This was made apparent to you at a tournament you attended and you have not been able to get past that ever since. I may be wrong, but that has been my observation for the past year. At least as a realist that is how it appears to me, traditionally speaking that is. (Boy, don't I feel stupid, having already made the statement that this is and will continue to be a hopeless and fruitless conversation).

Bearhugger wrote:

greencrush wrote:

Bearhugger wrote: The traditionalists can still have their fun and strive for second place. We need to take a hybrid approach to the situation at hand.

YOU want the second best wrestler from their own teams to compete in the state and regional tournaments tournament, meaning the BEST they could ever do is second place, meaning that YOU are the one who wants to normalize "striving for second place".
Nice underhanded jab at yourself. Well done.

The "second best" wrestler on a given team is also sometimes the second to 6th best in the whole state. The failures of people to be able to sort out these facts and recognize them differentiates us. I would suspect you were one that stayed home from school due to it being cold.

Your suspicion would be incorrect. Nice attempt at ad hominem though. You're incredibly infantile, as is the norm for someone who claims to be wise. This conversation with you is pointless and exhausting.
Stop spamming the forum with threads on the same topic. You are only trying to create a disjointed debate because you have no ground to stand on.

greencrush wrote:

Bearhugger wrote:

greencrush wrote:
YOU want the second best wrestler from their own teams to compete in the state and regional tournaments tournament, meaning the BEST they could ever do is second place, meaning that YOU are the one who wants to normalize "striving for second place".
Nice underhanded jab at yourself. Well done.

The "second best" wrestler on a given team is also sometimes the second to 6th best in the whole state. The failures of people to be able to sort out these facts and recognize them differentiates us. I would suspect you were one that stayed home from school due to it being cold.

Your suspicion would be incorrect. Nice attempt at ad hominem though. You're incredibly infantile, as is the norm for someone who claims to be wise. This conversation with you is pointless and exhausting.
Stop spamming the forum with threads on the same topic. You are only trying to create a disjointed debate because you have no ground to stand on.

This at least makes me feel less uncomfortable that my last post was too harsh (as a non-anonymous poster).

KDunbar wrote:

greencrush wrote:

Bearhugger wrote:
The "second best" wrestler on a given team is also sometimes the second to 6th best in the whole state. The failures of people to be able to sort out these facts and recognize them differentiates us. I would suspect you were one that stayed home from school due to it being cold.

Your suspicion would be incorrect. Nice attempt at ad hominem though. You're incredibly infantile, as is the norm for someone who claims to be wise. This conversation with you is pointless and exhausting.
Stop spamming the forum with threads on the same topic. You are only trying to create a disjointed debate because you have no ground to stand on.

This at least makes me feel less uncomfortable that my last post was too harsh (as a non-anonymous poster).

I might be less anonymous were I able to change my user name without losing my post history. At this point I'm pretty invested as greencrush.

greencrush wrote:

Bearhugger wrote:

greencrush wrote:
YOU want the second best wrestler from their own teams to compete in the state and regional tournaments tournament, meaning the BEST they could ever do is second place, meaning that YOU are the one who wants to normalize "striving for second place".
Nice underhanded jab at yourself. Well done.

The "second best" wrestler on a given team is also sometimes the second to 6th best in the whole state. The failures of people to be able to sort out these facts and recognize them differentiates us. I would suspect you were one that stayed home from school due to it being cold.

Your suspicion would be incorrect. Nice attempt at ad hominem though. You're incredibly infantile, as is the norm for someone who claims to be wise. This conversation with you is pointless and exhausting.
Stop spamming the forum with threads on the same topic. You are only trying to create a disjointed debate because you have no ground to stand on.

Keep doing what your doing Bearhugger. When that "JV" wrestler is also a lawyers wrestler one day the BOE will change very quickly!

Not much will be resolved of this issue on this site, in my opinion. Yes it sucks some kids will be left out of the state tournament because they have some very good wrestlers above them, but for right now, that's how it goes. I'm sure it already has been, but I would bring this to the attention of the WVSSAC.

Bearhugger keep it up, I agree with you on this topic 100%, guess the others do not understand the striving to be 2nd comment. I think of another topic that is just as strange, COY award goes to ?. I would think if any school regardless of class finishes season nationally ranked in their sport, that coaching staff should receive that award. Not the State tournament s 2-3 place teams coach.
I also agree with why post as anonymous, and the I didn't want to post loose history...you could keep the handle just to look at them and refer people to, I tend to listen or pay attention to people whom take ownership of their opinions. Be it good or bad.
I believe that is what forums are for, to discuss, debate, and sometimes wrinkle feathers. Keep up the outstanding commentary Bearhugger.

Im with greencrush on this one give it a rest please.

Your asking questions in the the wrong venue.
To be honest it is quiet mind numbing.

Then don't participate in the discussion. Your comments fuel the discussion. If you feel it mind numbing, If bearhugger starts a thread, don't read it, don't comment on it, leave your numb minds comments to yourself. Save us who enjoy the discussion your negative views, or snarky comments.

rodneyjwv wrote:Then don't participate in the discussion. Your comments fuel the discussion. If you feel it mind numbing, If bearhugger starts a thread, don't read it, don't comment on it, leave your numb minds comments to yourself. Save us who enjoy the discussion your negative views, or snarky comments.

AGREE!!!!!

greencrush wrote:

KDunbar wrote:

greencrush wrote:
Your suspicion would be incorrect. Nice attempt at ad hominem though. You're incredibly infantile, as is the norm for someone who claims to be wise. This conversation with you is pointless and exhausting.
Stop spamming the forum with threads on the same topic. You are only trying to create a disjointed debate because you have no ground to stand on.

This at least makes me feel less uncomfortable that my last post was too harsh (as a non-anonymous poster).

I might be less anonymous were I able to change my user name without losing my post history. At this point I'm pretty invested as greencrush.

Just contact the administrators to modify yet keep greencrush. See that 68 whiskey at the bottom of your posts, just change it to your name and you have instant ownership.