Which Pill?

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WP1992
Posts: 127
Joined: Wed Jan 22, 2014 11:39 am

Which Pill?

Postby WP1992 » Sat Feb 10, 2018 7:32 pm

When does the Pill get released to the public?

armyscot0873
Posts: 331
Joined: Thu Feb 16, 2012 10:13 am

Re: Which Pill?

Postby armyscot0873 » Sat Feb 10, 2018 8:31 pm

On the front page it says pill 2

WP1992
Posts: 127
Joined: Wed Jan 22, 2014 11:39 am

Re: Which Pill?

Postby WP1992 » Sat Feb 10, 2018 8:49 pm

I may be blind, but I do t see that

armyscot0873
Posts: 331
Joined: Thu Feb 16, 2012 10:13 am

Re: Which Pill?

Postby armyscot0873 » Sat Feb 10, 2018 8:55 pm

It's right under What's new. Below the list of regionals

armyscot0873
Posts: 331
Joined: Thu Feb 16, 2012 10:13 am

Re: Which Pill?

Postby armyscot0873 » Sat Feb 10, 2018 8:57 pm

Right below the link to the Twitter page.

mscoach64
Posts: 466
Joined: Sat Dec 27, 2014 6:35 pm

Re: Which Pill?

Postby mscoach64 » Sat Feb 10, 2018 10:01 pm

whats the details of Pill 2

Qualityshots
Posts: 153
Joined: Thu Feb 16, 2012 10:46 pm

Re: Which Pill?

Postby Qualityshots » Sat Feb 10, 2018 10:45 pm


mscoach4
Posts: 597
Joined: Wed Feb 15, 2012 4:00 pm

Re: Which Pill?

Postby mscoach4 » Sat Feb 10, 2018 10:49 pm


aacoach61
Posts: 237
Joined: Wed Feb 15, 2012 4:34 pm

Re: Which Pill?

Postby aacoach61 » Sat Feb 10, 2018 11:18 pm

I get that we do the “pill” to prevent sandbagging... but in all my years of coaching I never saw a kid lose a match on purpose to get an easier “next” match or to avoid a kid. Pee wee parents, possible. High school kids, no way. Oh,well.

RickDunbar
Posts: 89
Joined: Mon Dec 03, 2012 11:20 am

Re: Which Pill?

Postby RickDunbar » Sun Feb 11, 2018 7:59 am

Back in 2004, Brandon Rader from PHS took an injury default in the semi-finals of the Regions for the sole purpose of dropping down into the consolations to knock out Matt Dunn, a 3rd seeded South wrestler who had gotten upset in the quarter finals. Rader made a amazing recovery from his injury and beat Dunn an hour later to knock him out from qualifying for States.

It was the lowest thing that I have seen a coaching staff do in my life. The Head Coach, Scheny Schenerlein, bragged about the manouver in the stands.

At the time, Rader was a 2X State Champ and went on to be a 4X State Champ. Ironically, Shaun Smith was named the Outstanding Wrestler of the Year and South Head Coach, Tim McCarty, was named Coach of the Year.

We took the case to Circuit Court in the week between the Region and State in an attempt to allow Dunn to compete. It was a close call because Rader had not requested permission to re-enter the Tournament after the injury default as was required by the WVSAAC rules. This was confirmed by the testimony of the Morgantown Athletic Director. The Judge was a PHS graduate and supporter of the school and ruled in favor of PHS and stated that Dunn was merely a freshman and would have more opportunities to compete at the States in subsequent years.

PHS went on to win the State by merely 20 points over South.

aaacoach90
Posts: 87
Joined: Tue Feb 02, 2016 8:19 am

Re: Which Pill?

Postby aaacoach90 » Sun Feb 11, 2018 8:38 am

Id still trust someone i didnt like to seed this state tournament over the pill. There is a reason Pa stopped using it.

southfan123
Posts: 8
Joined: Wed Feb 15, 2012 7:59 pm

Re: Which Pill?

Postby southfan123 » Sun Feb 11, 2018 10:47 am

RickDunbar wrote:Back in 2004, Brandon Rader from PHS took an injury default in the semi-finals of the Regions for the sole purpose of dropping down into the consolations to knock out Matt Dunn, a 3rd seeded South wrestler who had gotten upset in the quarter finals. Rader made a amazing recovery from his injury and beat Dunn an hour later to knock him out from qualifying for States.

It was the lowest thing that I have seen a coaching staff do in my life. The Head Coach, Scheny Schenerlein, bragged about the manouver in the stands.

At the time, Rader was a 2X State Champ and went on to be a 4X State Champ. Ironically, Shaun Smith was named the Outstanding Wrestler of the Year and South Head Coach, Tim McCarty, was named Coach of the Year.

We took the case to Circuit Court in the week between the Region and State in an attempt to allow Dunn to compete. It was a close call because Rader had not requested permission to re-enter the Tournament after the injury default as was required by the WVSAAC rules. This was confirmed by the testimony of the Morgantown Athletic Director. The Judge was a PHS graduate and supporter of the school and ruled in favor of PHS and stated that Dunn was merely a freshman and would have more opportunities to compete at the States in subsequent years.

PHS went on to win the State by merely 20 points over South.



Id forgotten about that one, now I'm mad again, ;-). Also happened in 1987 at AAA Region 1 tourney, Team A forfeited finals match to Team B knowing the winner would be in the same bracket as another high seed and Team A wrestler would have a less difficult road to the finals. Region 1 winner lost in the semis at states. It has happened a few times in high school.

vortexfan
Posts: 431
Joined: Sun Feb 28, 2016 8:48 pm

Re: Which Pill?

Postby vortexfan » Sun Feb 11, 2018 11:29 am

RickDunbar wrote:Back in 2004, Brandon Rader from PHS took an injury default in the semi-finals of the Regions for the sole purpose of dropping down into the consolations to knock out Matt Dunn, a 3rd seeded South wrestler who had gotten upset in the quarter finals. Rader made a amazing recovery from his injury and beat Dunn an hour later to knock him out from qualifying for States.

It was the lowest thing that I have seen a coaching staff do in my life. The Head Coach, Scheny Schenerlein, bragged about the manouver in the stands.

At the time, Rader was a 2X State Champ and went on to be a 4X State Champ. Ironically, Shaun Smith was named the Outstanding Wrestler of the Year and South Head Coach, Tim McCarty, was named Coach of the Year.

We took the case to Circuit Court in the week between the Region and State in an attempt to allow Dunn to compete. It was a close call because Rader had not requested permission to re-enter the Tournament after the injury default as was required by the WVSAAC rules. This was confirmed by the testimony of the Morgantown Athletic Director. The Judge was a PHS graduate and supporter of the school and ruled in favor of PHS and stated that Dunn was merely a freshman and would have more opportunities to compete at the States in subsequent years.

PHS went on to win the State by merely 20 points over South.


Kinda speechless on that one except that was lower than whale doo doo for a coach to exhibit that kinda sportsmanship or hate to another school. As Taylor Swift sings haters going to hate hate hate. As for Coach of the year I for one would prefer it to go to a school that made a good finish not just winning State title, If u look at the pool of wrestlers what they have and finish high proves good coaching. A coach could be a lot more successful coaching South,PHS,Huntington than schools like Ripley, John Marshall etc..

Bearhugger
Posts: 5078
Joined: Tue Dec 25, 2012 12:14 am

Re: Which Pill?

Postby Bearhugger » Sun Feb 11, 2018 11:54 am

RickDunbar wrote:Back in 2004, Brandon Rader from PHS took an injury default in the semi-finals of the Regions for the sole purpose of dropping down into the consolations to knock out Matt Dunn, a 3rd seeded South wrestler who had gotten upset in the quarter finals. Rader made a amazing recovery from his injury and beat Dunn an hour later to knock him out from qualifying for States.

It was the lowest thing that I have seen a coaching staff do in my life. The Head Coach, Scheny Schenerlein, bragged about the manouver in the stands.

At the time, Rader was a 2X State Champ and went on to be a 4X State Champ. Ironically, Shaun Smith was named the Outstanding Wrestler of the Year and South Head Coach, Tim McCarty, was named Coach of the Year.

We took the case to Circuit Court in the week between the Region and State in an attempt to allow Dunn to compete. It was a close call because Rader had not requested permission to re-enter the Tournament after the injury default as was required by the WVSAAC rules. This was confirmed by the testimony of the Morgantown Athletic Director. The Judge was a PHS graduate and supporter of the school and ruled in favor of PHS and stated that Dunn was merely a freshman and would have more opportunities to compete at the States in subsequent years.

PHS went on to win the State by merely 20 points over South.


Interesting story and I am surprised I have never heard it before. The lowest thing I have ever heard a coaching staff do occurred this season.
Holy smokes. Braxton Amos works out with a landmine now!!!!!!

mscoach20
Posts: 234
Joined: Wed Feb 15, 2012 6:05 pm

Re: Which Pill?

Postby mscoach20 » Sun Feb 11, 2018 3:13 pm

I can’t believe that went to court.......that’s sad.
Tench

Gutorone
Posts: 59
Joined: Wed Jan 22, 2014 12:38 pm

Re: Which Pill?

Postby Gutorone » Sun Feb 11, 2018 4:36 pm

Now , now Rick. Appears that as a lawyer you are spinning that story in a shady light . Coaches move wrestlers around all the time to benefit their team. So Coach Schenerlein was a genius in doing what he did. It got his team a state title . And the South coach DID NOT win coach of the year . Now did he ? He shared the title with someone. WHO? That means , a bunch of coaches in the states thought the coach from PHS was a great coach and that was a brilliant move! I dont know what the MOW has to do with the story , but since YOU mentioned it, did your coach then not do a switch a roo the next year to avoid a grudge match. :mrgreen:
Last edited by Gutorone on Sun Feb 11, 2018 5:15 pm, edited 2 times in total.

mscoach20
Posts: 234
Joined: Wed Feb 15, 2012 6:05 pm

Re: Which Pill?

Postby mscoach20 » Sun Feb 11, 2018 4:40 pm

Gutorone wrote:Now , now Rick. Appears that as a lawyer you are spinning that story in a shady light . Coaches move wrestlers around all the time to benefit their team. So Coach Schenerlein was a genius in doing what he did. It got his team a state title . And the South couch DID NOT win coach of the year . Now did he ? He shared the title with someone. WHO? That means , a bunch of coaches in the states though Coach from PHS was a great coach and that was a brilliant move! I dont know what the MOW has to do with the story , but since YOU mentioned it, did your coach then not do a swcith a roo the next year to avoid a grudge match. :mrgreen:


Plus the 3 seed should have beaten the 6 seed and this never happens.
Tench

shemailman
Posts: 82
Joined: Mon May 15, 2017 8:04 am

Re: Which Pill?

Postby shemailman » Sun Feb 11, 2018 5:20 pm

Bearhugger wrote:
RickDunbar wrote:Back in 2004, Brandon Rader from PHS took an injury default in the semi-finals of the Regions for the sole purpose of dropping down into the consolations to knock out Matt Dunn, a 3rd seeded South wrestler who had gotten upset in the quarter finals. Rader made a amazing recovery from his injury and beat Dunn an hour later to knock him out from qualifying for States.

It was the lowest thing that I have seen a coaching staff do in my life. The Head Coach, Scheny Schenerlein, bragged about the manouver in the stands.

At the time, Rader was a 2X State Champ and went on to be a 4X State Champ. Ironically, Shaun Smith was named the Outstanding Wrestler of the Year and South Head Coach, Tim McCarty, was named Coach of the Year.

We took the case to Circuit Court in the week between the Region and State in an attempt to allow Dunn to compete. It was a close call because Rader had not requested permission to re-enter the Tournament after the injury default as was required by the WVSAAC rules. This was confirmed by the testimony of the Morgantown Athletic Director. The Judge was a PHS graduate and supporter of the school and ruled in favor of PHS and stated that Dunn was merely a freshman and would have more opportunities to compete at the States in subsequent years.

PHS went on to win the State by merely 20 points over South.


Interesting story and I am surprised I have never heard it before. The lowest thing I have ever heard a coaching staff do occurred this season.


Yes it was extremely low as is the situation you’re speaking of. Clearly there are more scumbags in our sport than we thought. No wonder WV wrestling can’t get ahead.
"Trans people deserve something vital; they deserve your respect. From that respect comes a more compassionate community."

-Caitlyn Jenner

shemailman
Posts: 82
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Re: Which Pill?

Postby shemailman » Sun Feb 11, 2018 5:22 pm

mscoach20 wrote:
Gutorone wrote:Now , now Rick. Appears that as a lawyer you are spinning that story in a shady light . Coaches move wrestlers around all the time to benefit their team. So Coach Schenerlein was a genius in doing what he did. It got his team a state title . And the South couch DID NOT win coach of the year . Now did he ? He shared the title with someone. WHO? That means , a bunch of coaches in the states though Coach from PHS was a great coach and that was a brilliant move! I dont know what the MOW has to do with the story , but since YOU mentioned it, did your coach then not do a swcith a roo the next year to avoid a grudge match. :mrgreen:


Plus the 3 seed should have beaten the 6 seed and this never happens.


Great conclusion buddy. It sounds like your a great role model for student athletes as well. Except not really.
"Trans people deserve something vital; they deserve your respect. From that respect comes a more compassionate community."

-Caitlyn Jenner

RickDunbar
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Re: Which Pill?

Postby RickDunbar » Sun Feb 11, 2018 5:31 pm

Not spun in any direction. All my facts were accurate except I did miss the fact that there was a tie for Coach of the Year. It was Coach Schenerlien who tied with him.

If it appears shady, it's because it was.

I am not familiar with any move the next season but I am sure it did not have anything to do with asking a wrestler to lose or forfeit a match to simply prevent a competing team's wrestler from advancing to States.

Bearhugger
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Re: Which Pill?

Postby Bearhugger » Sun Feb 11, 2018 5:33 pm

shemailman wrote:
Bearhugger wrote:
RickDunbar wrote:Back in 2004, Brandon Rader from PHS took an injury default in the semi-finals of the Regions for the sole purpose of dropping down into the consolations to knock out Matt Dunn, a 3rd seeded South wrestler who had gotten upset in the quarter finals. Rader made a amazing recovery from his injury and beat Dunn an hour later to knock him out from qualifying for States.

It was the lowest thing that I have seen a coaching staff do in my life. The Head Coach, Scheny Schenerlein, bragged about the manouver in the stands.

At the time, Rader was a 2X State Champ and went on to be a 4X State Champ. Ironically, Shaun Smith was named the Outstanding Wrestler of the Year and South Head Coach, Tim McCarty, was named Coach of the Year.

We took the case to Circuit Court in the week between the Region and State in an attempt to allow Dunn to compete. It was a close call because Rader had not requested permission to re-enter the Tournament after the injury default as was required by the WVSAAC rules. This was confirmed by the testimony of the Morgantown Athletic Director. The Judge was a PHS graduate and supporter of the school and ruled in favor of PHS and stated that Dunn was merely a freshman and would have more opportunities to compete at the States in subsequent years.

PHS went on to win the State by merely 20 points over South.


Interesting story and I am surprised I have never heard it before. The lowest thing I have ever heard a coaching staff do occurred this season.


Yes it was extremely low as is the situation you’re speaking of. Clearly there are more scumbags in our sport than we thought. No wonder WV wrestling can’t get ahead.


Indeed
Holy smokes. Braxton Amos works out with a landmine now!!!!!!

Gator
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Re: Which Pill?

Postby Gator » Sun Feb 11, 2018 5:56 pm

So much I could add to this story, but think I’ll take the high road.
Moderator WV Mat

Bearhugger
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Re: Which Pill?

Postby Bearhugger » Sun Feb 11, 2018 6:00 pm

Gator wrote:So much I could add to this story, but think I’ll take the high road.


You must be lacking in "Keyboard Courage" today. Go create a new screen name and return with the story.

I suggest a screen name like "IamNOTGator".
Holy smokes. Braxton Amos works out with a landmine now!!!!!!

Gator
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Location: South Parkersburg-Moderator WV Mat

Re: Which Pill?

Postby Gator » Sun Feb 11, 2018 6:13 pm

Bearhugger wrote:
Gator wrote:So much I could add to this story, but think I’ll take the high road.


You must be lacking in "Keyboard Courage" today. Go create a new screen name and return with the story.

I suggest a screen name like "IamNOTGator".



That is one thing I’ve never “Dunn”, but have been tempted.

Mrs Michael is correct in saying that people get brave under a screen name. Mine is my nickname but most people know who I am. Nothing to hide here.
Moderator WV Mat

Schenerlein
Posts: 3
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Re: Which Pill?

Postby Schenerlein » Sun Feb 11, 2018 6:40 pm

Interesting that I’m still a topic of conversation as I’ve been an AD & peewee coach in FL for 6 years. Anyway, many inaccuracies in Mr. Dunbar’s post.

I never bragged in the stands. If anyone remembers me coaching they can attest that I rarely set in the stands during tournaments.

McCartney & I tied for Coach of Year (who cares).

The Morgantown AD knew zero about wrestling and never said that Rader didn’t ask permission to re-enter the tournament & this isn’t even a rule.

I conferred with the head referee before defaulting to insure it was legal and Rader still wrestle.

Lastly, Judge Hill (RIP) was not a PHS grad. He graduated from Fairmont SR.

Thanks and good luck at state tournament!

RickDunbar
Posts: 89
Joined: Mon Dec 03, 2012 11:20 am

Re: Which Pill?

Postby RickDunbar » Sun Feb 11, 2018 8:47 pm

It was indeed a WVSSAC rule back in 2004 that a wrestler who defaulted had to get permission to re-enter the Tournament. The Morgantown AD did testify under oath by telephone in Judge Hill's chambers that no one from the coaching staff had obtained his approval for Rader to re-enter the event. I do not personally recall anything from the hearing about a referee being involved but certainly could have been the case.

Judge Hill did have a picture of Parkersburg High School in his office and his daughter did graduate from there.

My point was that it was a crappy thing to do to a kid.

mscoach20
Posts: 234
Joined: Wed Feb 15, 2012 6:05 pm

Re: Which Pill?

Postby mscoach20 » Sun Feb 11, 2018 9:17 pm

shemailman wrote:
mscoach20 wrote:
Gutorone wrote:Now , now Rick. Appears that as a lawyer you are spinning that story in a shady light . Coaches move wrestlers around all the time to benefit their team. So Coach Schenerlein was a genius in doing what he did. It got his team a state title . And the South couch DID NOT win coach of the year . Now did he ? He shared the title with someone. WHO? That means , a bunch of coaches in the states though Coach from PHS was a great coach and that was a brilliant move! I dont know what the MOW has to do with the story , but since YOU mentioned it, did your coach then not do a swcith a roo the next year to avoid a grudge match. :mrgreen:


Plus the 3 seed should have beaten the 6 seed and this never happens.


Great conclusion buddy. It sounds like your a great role model for student athletes as well. Except not really.


I'm not sure how making that comment has anything to do with anything...but ok.
Tench

shemailman
Posts: 82
Joined: Mon May 15, 2017 8:04 am

Re: Which Pill?

Postby shemailman » Sun Feb 11, 2018 10:07 pm

mscoach20 wrote:
shemailman wrote:
mscoach20 wrote:
Plus the 3 seed should have beaten the 6 seed and this never happens.


Great conclusion buddy. It sounds like your a great role model for student athletes as well. Except not really.


I'm not sure how making that comment has anything to do with anything...but ok.


Judging by your previous comment it sounds like you don’t think that it was a terrible thing to do to a kid. Schenerlein isn’t known for being the most upstanding citizen but it was beyond low for even him. I guess it was funny too when people affiliated with phs made shirts that said It’s a “Dunn” deal on them pertaining to the last name of the “kid.” It seems as though you would fit in with those individuals. So good for you.
"Trans people deserve something vital; they deserve your respect. From that respect comes a more compassionate community."

-Caitlyn Jenner

mscoach20
Posts: 234
Joined: Wed Feb 15, 2012 6:05 pm

Re: Which Pill?

Postby mscoach20 » Sun Feb 11, 2018 10:20 pm

shemailman wrote:
mscoach20 wrote:
shemailman wrote:
Great conclusion buddy. It sounds like your a great role model for student athletes as well. Except not really.


I'm not sure how making that comment has anything to do with anything...but ok.


Judging by your previous comment it sounds like you don’t think that it was a terrible thing to do to a kid. Schenerlein isn’t known for being the most upstanding citizen but it was beyond low for even him. I guess it was funny too when people affiliated with phs made shirts that said It’s a “Dunn” deal on them pertaining to the last name of the “kid.” It seems as though you would fit in with those individuals. So good for you.


You got all of this from my comment? I believe this is a classic situation where you find what you’re looking for. Clearly none of that was implied by the fact if 3 beats 6 this convo never happens...
Tench

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TheBoxer
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Re: Which Pill?

Postby TheBoxer » Mon Feb 12, 2018 10:49 am

While that story is interesting. I could go either way on a dirty move or a brilliant one. BUT... What does that have to do with the Pill? I'm sure there was a regional runner-up that was miserable about it a week later but did it change the outcome of the state tournament. (other than perceived points that would be scored?)


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